The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Well, I used to carry a custom fullsized CZ-75B. Then I needed something smaller for work, so I got a Kahr MK 9. Then I needed something A LOT smaller for work after I got a position in a secured facility so I traded the MK-9 for a Bobcat.

Now that I am a mostly free man I found that I liked carrying in my front pocket rather than in an IWB holster but I was unsatisfied with the Bobcat's .22lr caliber and I wasn't fond of the capacity or or need to replace recoil springs every few hundred rounds on the Kahr. I wanted something that was compact, but durable enough to stand up to heavy use at the range that fired a respectable caliber and would still ride comfortably in my pocket.

After much consideration I decided to give a Makarov a try. It holds 8 rounds per mag, +2 compared to the MK-9, fires the 9x18mak cartridge that packs less punch than 9x19 but more than .380acp and it's a steel framed military pistol boasting the businesslike reliability common to many Soviet bloc weapons.

I've got a Russian made military model with fixed sites, apparently unissued, and the thing's a tack driver! I get groups that are one ragged hole at 7 yards without even really trying, this with 95gr Silver Bear hollowpoints which like most Russian ammo aren't exactly match grade... The sights don't allow for much misalignment, it points well for me and I'm sure the fixed barrel helps a lot. I've shot older Euro autoloaders before so I'm comfortable with the heel mag relase and carry a few spares in a pocket because you never know.

Since there's always room for jello here's some interesting ballistics tests.

http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/9x18/gel9x18.htm

All in all these are great little guns. I hope some more get imported soon.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I love my Kahr P9 and it shoots available-everywhere 9mm. To each his own.

:rolleyes:

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Yeah, I wouldn't dis Kahr. The MK-9 is a very small 9mm by design, the need to frequently replace the recoil spring is simply a function of putting so much gun in so small a package. The overall craftsmanship and strength of the all steel frame were primary selling points. I had actually gone shopping with the intent to buy a P3-AT but the MK-9 made those puppydog eyes I couldn't resist.

As far as ammo availability goes, I can get my hands on enough 9x18 locally that I'm not worried. If for some reason it all dried up all I need to do is swap barrels and start shooting .380's. There's stuff you can improvise, too, like reaming out the chamber to accomedate a 9x19mm case and loading the 9mm brass to 9x18 specs. On the subject of multicaliber functionality, I intend to get a .22lr conversion kit for use with my Mak.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

When I go to work-I prefer my GAU.(Dillon-made in America-by Americans):coolbeer:They are getting the weight down below 50 lbs, due to titanium parts.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I have the Kahr PM-9. Put my first 200 "break-in" rounds through it at Christmas. Not too hard to keep it within 10 inches at 10 yards with cheap Winchester FMJ. All-in-all it is incredibly small which is what really counted for me.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I thought the 9MM Mak was a hotter round than the 9MM Nato??
I thought the velocity was better. Ah well.

Did you change out the grips Rev? Not a lot of cushion if I remember correctly.

Thanks for the review.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Nope, I'm keeping the stock grips, I kinda like them just because they're weird. I don't have any trouble with the recoil at all, just a tiny bit of trigger slap but I should be able to massage that out. The trigger pull is different than that of Western guns, AK's are similar in this respect, but neither this fact nor the slap affect my accuracy. As I said, this thing is scary accurate which makes it a lot of fun at the range.

I will probably gunkote my Mak since it's a blued finish. (Worth noting; Makarovs have chromed bores regardless of finish.) The only other mod I'm considering right now is swapping over to a 19lbs recoil spring as insurance against frame battering with hotter ammo. Since it's a direct blowback action a heavier spring would tend to delay ejection just a little and it would be interesting to chrono some standard loadings to see if they might pick up a few fps with the heavier spring installed.

Something I should have mentioned from a hobby gunsmithing or survivalist perspective is the parts count is only 26 for the gun and 4 for the mag, unlike many other double actions this one is easy to do a complete teardown and rebuild on.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Hey Rev: I'm a Mak freak too. Have a Bulgarian and Russian mil. Sold my East German. I like the Makarov for concealed carry thanks to it's small size and it is flat. I use the $150 Bulgie for every day stuff and keep the $600 Ruskie in the safe mainly due to valuation. Tried the Polish version P-64 but the DA pull was really stiff.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I agree the Makarav is a better "range gun".

There is a big difference in concealability between the P9 and the MK9 Kahrs.
The P9 is very thin and thus the best 9mm concealed carry gun.

A defense gun should not have a safety.

A pocket pistol should not have a safety.

If you have to press a Makarov, Walther PPK or Beretta into action you first have to snick off the safety....if it's still on that is. After the first time you remove the gun from your pocket and find the safety is off you will get tired of carrying it. Also, what if in the heat of a struggle you push the safety in the other direction as in your ______? Safeties are for rifles and range guns.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Actually I carry my Makarov in condition 2, since it's a double action all you have to do is draw and squeeze same as a revolver. I keep my gun in a pocket holster so there's no chance of the safety being inadvertently engaged, which would be difficult in the first place because it clicks rather authoritatively into place. Besides, the whole point of pocket carry to me is the fact that you can have your hand on your weapon when you don't need to draw yet but you might have to. Situational awareness should give you the queue, it's a trifle to rub your thumb against the selector and ensure that it is in the down position.

I prefer condition 2 with most double action guns because I consider it to be as fast and safer than condition 1 but as far as operating the weapon goes it really doesn't matter to me. I would hate to tout myself as some kind of weapons expert but the fact of the matter is that I'm well practiced in these arts and I'm no stranger to a fight. I believe the common wisdom regarding gross motor skills is completely valid and applicable for most people in self defense situations and there is nothing unmasculine about that, it's just logical sense and the average person would be a fool to not take it into account. For someone with experience who has trained a lot and can keep cool under pressure it's still not a bad idea, but it isn't a make or break issue, either.

If you've ever seen a fencing match between two people who were really skilled you'll know what I'm talking about. I studied under a man who routinely won bouts against other highly skilled people, he was really something to see. He wasn't flashy, didn't try to be El Zoro, but he could completely confound you with a string of a few calculated movements while you were still trying to respond to his first. He knew his art and could disrupt most people's OODA loop at will. Early on he gave me the chills during a training session when we were practicing disengaging and taking the inside line with me from various positions. As I said, I've been in fights before and can usually give as good as I get against most people. He wasn't even trying to be intimidating, but I could just tell from the way he moved that I was pwned. If you've ever studied the foil, the real stuff not the olympic style electric scoring nonsense, you understand that much of the technique makes use of fine adjustments of the wrist and elbow, not what I'd call gross motor skills.

The point is if the outcome of fighting for my life comes down to my ability to hit a manual safety or slide release, I'm having an easy day. Everybody has different things they're comfortable with for personal reasons. I actually like revolvers quite a lot, but I prefer the 7 or 8 shot .357's to the 5 shot .38's. I've been outnumbered in most of my fights so I'm edgey about that.

As far as what to do if you're safety gets inadvertently engaged in a struggle, you'd do the same thing you would if your gun failed to fire for any other reason while grappling, transition to another form of attack be that empty hand, knife, pistol whipping or whatever else you have at your disposal. A life or death wrestling match is no place to start troubleshooting failure to fire issues.

I have often wondered why there aren't any double action semi auto rifles. You'd gain speed and safety under certain circumstances and you'd have a second try at that hard primer if/when your arcade trigger finger kicks in before you recognize the failure to fire. The CZ-style action would be perfect for this as the single action trigger pull is great and the weapon can still be carried condition 1.

My Russian Mak is actually a Bulgarian sneak. It's a nice gun, but not particularly collectible as far as I'm aware. I was actually shopping for a cheap Bulgarian Makarov when I got this one, but aparently there are few Makarovs of any kind left in town and mine cost only $50 more than average. It would suck beyond all belief to have this gun confiscated after use in a self defense situation, but it isn't irreplaceable. I just don't want to have to shoot anybody and I'd like to keep this one for the rest of my life. I wish some more would show up on the market as I'd like to get a cheap, common but quality Mak to do some more extensive mods on like novak sights(purely cosmeticc for me, but spiffy nonetheless), maybe an OD green frame and slide, custom trigger guard, that kind of stuff.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I prevailed in fencing class just by being left-handed. Although I love my Kahr P9 a lot...in a street fight what mtnman said about the revolver makes the most sense.

I dunno...Life is a matter of trade-offs. As many opinions about guns as owners.

:beer: pistol vs. revolver is a very old debate.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Hmm... I'm guessing these fencing classes you're talking about were at the Y or college? I've always been better with a saber than a foil but being left handed alone won't get you anywhere against fencers.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Being left-handed is even an advantage in street fighting. Some Righties don't even see it coming. But we digress.

:beer:

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Actually it is mostly an advantage over the untutored, regardless of venue and applies to the world of firearms just as it does in hand to hand combat. I don't know any serious student of any martial discipline who doesn't train lefted handed or against the left handed. It isn't that big of a deal and regardless of your art blows to both the right and left side are commonly encountered. I'm not trying to call you out but you've made a pretty bold statement. I suspect we're just on different levels.

My wife is a righty but left eye dominant, so she shoots lefthanded. She found it easier to learn to change hands than change eyes and it worked out that she's an excellent markswoman. It works out pretty good for me as well as it encourages me to shoot southpaw every range session. She owns a .357 revolver and it's got me practicing the lefthanded use of speedloaders. Ambidexterity isn't just for the possibility of having your dominant hand disabled but also affects how you work cover in a firefight. If you only shoot right handed you're either forced to use only the right side of your cover which will quickly become predictable and your enemy will likely just set up his shot after supressing you so the next time you stick your head out you're dead or else you'll be forced to expose much more of your body when firing from the left side of your cover. The cool thing about having a wife who shoots left handed is that we can work the same piece of cover as a team and both be in our most natural shooting position.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Those involved in street fights are generally drunken idiots. Half of them are seeing double when they go down. Bouncers in bars take out the trash every Friday night. It's the quiet guy who doesn't go off until he does that has my respect.

:cheers: calling me out?

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Most streetfights are between untutored idiots, nothing particularly bold about that statement. The idea that a person can dominate a salle based on being lefthanded however is pretty bold, like if someone suggested a sober bouncer could be easily defeated by a lefthanded drunken idiot. It just don't work that way.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

We all normally walk down the sidewalk on the right side. A Leftie can sucker-punch you before you know it. A Rightie must noticeably turn his entire body before throwing a punch. Going through shared doorways same thing. Going up/down stairways same thing. Lefties enjoy a greater element of surprise.

How many men participate in formal honorable fighting in the real world?

:rolleyes: we obviously just disagree about the advantages of being a Leftie in a brutish world..

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

you know in aikido they taught me to stand with what in karate we called a right hand lead. I said why, they said just like holding a sword, that's why, which is evidently the explanation of a lot of aikido, but you got a right foot and right hand lead. anyhow that orientation is definitely different. westerners habitually will square up boxing style like karate guys do with a left and and left foot lead.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

anyhow I have loved the mak for similar purposes for years. I shoot 1911s in comp but I dont mind the da/sa setup of the mak at all, other than the obvious downside of the different trigger pull throwing your shots off.

its a sturdy freakin gun that's for sure. hornady used to sell good JHPs for it.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

It looks like we were talking about two different things, you're talking about streetfighting/self defense against the average man on the street and I was talking about your fencing comment.

As far as practical skills go left handed fighting is a very useful tool you should learn after you progress beyond the basics because it works well on those who aren't well practiced in a fighting art. Against a more advanced opponent it is better to shift, switching up between right and left at random intervals or off the beat, to keep him guessing till you can do something decisive. If you really want the upper hand on most fighters out there study techniques that attack and defend at the same time. The cross counter is a simple example anyone can learn quickly.

Aside from sport few people square up for a formal fight these days. Plenty of people fight for "honor" but it's usually a rather brusque encounter like what you see on Jerry Springer. Sword skills do translate to other weapons very well though, from an improvised stick to my 30" Asp baton. A skilled foil, epee, smallsword or rapier man can stick the point of an umbrella between your eyes, at close range or from a suprising distance, faster than most people could throw a punch. Not me, I was never that good with thrusting weapons. As a saber man I can smash a hand, break a clavicle and knock a knee out from somebody with three quicking motions with my Asp.

Speaking of which, I like the Asp batons as a backup to a gun, along with pepperspray. A knife is a good weapon too, but in this day and age you never know if some fool has AIDS, hepatitis or who knows what, I'd prefer to keep the messy business at a distance. The Asp is compatible with many stick and knife fighting systems, has a reach advantage and can escalate force from a bloodless reprimand all the way to a lethal attack. Pepperspray has its obvious nonlethal defense applications but I also like it for the medium fog units' ability to create your own personal area of denial, fight around corners, discourage pursuit, etc.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

This Spyderco folder opens with your thumb and if you suddenly engage it on a sidewalk, or in a stairway/doorway, again, the Leftie has the advantage of surprise. The Rightie would not have this advantage. Fencing up real close and personal.

Scroll up and we read comments about "fumbling" with handgun safeties. Even in the gunfight world the element of surprise is considered and that is why a d/a revolver makes sense to me.. I don't believe a Leftie has any advantage in a gun fight.

:beer: Your comments about trained alpha fighters seem reasonable. I am not one.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

My wife carries an Endura, SpyderCo makes a good knife for a reasonable price. I used to carry a Benchmade but I eventually wore it out. I'm looking to replace it with a puukko.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

An Endura has been in my left-front pocket for years. Your wife has good judgment and taste.

:smile:

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

What a small world. My wife gave me lessions for historical fencing for a xmas. I have my 3rd class tomorrow with the two handed sword. Let me tell you, it is NOT like the sport of fencing. I love it!!! Learning how to kill (for self defence of course) has much more utility.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Cool! Do you mean two handed as in greatsword or longsword? I've done some longsword, I understand the basics but never got much further than that with it. It's certainly a worthwhile pursuit that translates well to the real world. If you haven't done any halfswording yet you're in for some fun!

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

WAAH! Russian Maks are now $600? I bought one for a little over a hundred dollars back in 93 when I bought a case of unissued Russian SKSs for $105 each. Played with it for a few months and traded it in on a stainless Taurus 22 magnum. Nice flat strongly built compact gun. Could never get my 25 yard groups under 6-7 inches, but a lot of that could have been me and a lack of other ammo to try than the Russian issue stuff. Miss it, especial since I now have one of those east german field jackets with the build-in hidden left breast pockets made for it.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I can't find a commercial Bulgarian Mak for less than $300 locally. The Russians are usually more around $400 and the doublestacks command a premium over that. Unfortunately many thousands of perfectly good Makarovs that are being replaced in foreign countries are destroyed rather than surplussed out to the US and other nations of shooters as part of some twisted UN disarmament program. I won't post the pics of Tokarevs and Makarovs in unissued state being destroyed by the containerfull as it's too painful.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Yep, sorry bout that. Well, actually, the Mil ver with fixed rear sight is 6 bills. You can get a Ruskie commercial with adjustable sights, IJ-70, for about 3. East German for about 3, Bulgie about 1.5 to 2.:beer:
Still have any extra Ruskie SKSs?

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I wouldn't mind a Russian SKS to go with my Makarov and 91/30. Last time I saw one was a couple years ago, just under $500 in average condition.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Nope on the Russian SKSs, all are long gone except for the most accurate. The last one that went was the prettyest. Sold that one for $300 about six years ago

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Quote:

We all normally walk down the sidewalk on the right side. A Leftie can sucker-punch you before you know it. A Rightie must noticeably turn his entire body before throwing a punch. Going through shared doorways same thing. Going up/down stairways same thing. Lefties enjoy a greater element of surprise. How many men participate in formal honorable fighting in the real world?

I've got to say something here. I agree with Rev on this. Training is much more important then what hand you are naturally dominant in. For the untrained you are probably right that being lefty is an advantage but so are many other factors like strength, speed etc.

As for sucker punching someone, it is not really my style, but I have a moderate amount of MMA training and I am perfectly comfortable sucker punching (or kicking) someone with either hand if I felt it was the best option.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

:stickyman two against one?

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

paid $150 for mine bout ten years ago. I would not pay more than $300 for this piece much as I like it. I would rather get a FEG PPK if I had to pay that much. Similar piece, just a slightly wimpier round. Then again I wouldnt pay more than 180 for that either. lol

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

how much would you pay for one of those sweet arsenal refinished SKS's they imported in a big batch bout 15 yrs ago? Nice red varnished stock, folding blade bayonet, completely refinished metal, nice chrome barrel. Fantasic rifle.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I remember Koy, who was a guide, favored the Makarov as well, for all the same reasons.

TS

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

also, that spyderco is a fantastic shiv, it's got a keen edge that holds, pretty long for a pocket blade, nice slim profile, great handle-- what's not to like?

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Actually I'm not buying any guns for myself at the momment, but it looks like my wife might be getting a new pistol soon. In a few months I might look into getting a Russian SKS in nice shape, but I don't think I'd put more than $600 into it as I have another project I'm look towards; a milled AK in 6.5x39. I'll probably be getting a forge and anvil soon and I've even been thinking about trying my hand at scratch building a reciever and bolt carrier for a custom 6.5x39 AK/RK 95 hybrid. Technically I'm up to the challenge but I don't know what my time will be looking like since I waste a lot here plus I'm farming and trading now. I haven't quite yet completed my latest chicken tractor but I've only got a day or two's worth of work yet.

Time. Money. I'd rather be shooting. :emotions16:

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

you saying you have an extra to let go???

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

In the latest Shotgun News, on the front page they have advertised a FEG PA63 in 9x18 light weight alloy frame for $129.95, is this the gun you are referring to ?

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

I have a PA-63, a knockoff of a true makarov. Nice little gun, very ballanced and the chrome frame is beautiful.

Re: The Makarov Is A Good Little Gun!
 

Thanks for the reply, right now they are inexpensive so I will look into them.:cool2: